18 Comments on Greenpoint Gentrification Watch: We Have Arrived (AGAIN)!

al oof on Tue, 2nd Dec 2008 8:13 pm


i can’t say i agree. i can see lactation consultant as funny, but i don’t really connect it with gentrification. paying 4 dollars for coffee, yes. having literally trendy restaurants, yes. 700,000 dollar condominiums, yes. but someone who’s into natural stuff and midwifery and all that junk, just doesn’t connect for me. i mean, this person might be a gentrifier, but their being a certified lactation consultant isn’t what makes them one.

missheather on Tue, 2nd Dec 2008 8:55 pm


al oof: I love ya, but I have to disagree with your disagreement. 😉

If someone has trouble lactating they should take up the matter with a doctor, not a “Breastfeeding Circle” (*shudder*) or a “certified lactation expert” (which charges $20.00 per session/$100 for a full year membership). It’s not my purpose to malign “natural stuff”. Or the proprietress of this store (who I have heard is really nice.)

I just don’t get why something mankind has performed successfully for the last ???? years (hence why you, I and everyone else reading this are here) somehow now requires support groups and certified consultants. For pay. If breast-feeding moms want to chat, I understand that. If they want to exchange advice, so be it. There are plenty of parenting groups offline and online (in Greenpoint and beyond) for just this purpose. What’s more, they’re totally free.

That said you have to admit the invite to meet “Breastfeeding Moms” is SERIOUS pervert bait, al. I say this as someone who once worked for a crime victims board and was once told a story by a co-worker (back when she was working at a battered women’s shelter). They were interviewing prospective employees. A man came in and gave his reason/interest for working there as follows:

I want to meet women.

Uh. HUH.

leavesofabsence on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 4:47 am


First off, your pithy observation regarding the usefulness of lactation consultants is painfully, no- pitifully, ignorant. Your confusion about breastfeeding is almost sickening, considering the fact that you’re (purportedly) a woman. But first, I’ll deal with the gentrification issue.

I’m not going to pretend I really know what gentrification means, BUT, as the term is (loosely) used by persons who were born after 1975, it usually involves some affluent, yuppie types, invading a neighborhood populated by lower-income individuals. Besides changing the character of a neighborhood, the defining aspect of gentrification is that long-time residents are priced out and end up moving away.

This doesn’t apply to Greenpoint. Yes, its an ethnic enclave. Yes there is some spillover from williamsburg. And yes, some of these people have kids. So what? Greenpoint is a lily-white, upper-middle class neighborhood, and it has been for quite some time. Rents are not much lower than they are in Park Slope—and its still primarily polish families that are paying these rents. Are you under the impression that the middle-class Polish residents are being pushed out into Bushwick? Gentrification always involves the replacement of one population with another. As of now, there is no Polish exodus out Greenpoint. Maybe there will be at some point in the future, but right now, its silly to throw around a term like gentrification.

On to lactation. Full disclosure: I’m a male, and cannot lactate. But I am a father, and I’ve come as close as I can to the experience short of having an infant give me a titty-twister every 2 hours for 6-12 months.

“If someone has trouble lactating they should take up the matter with a doctor..”
You have an unusually high opinion of doctors. Have you been to one recently? Doctors don’t necessarily know shit about anything except their specific field of practice–and even then their judgment is questionable. Since many of us are stuck with using shitty HMOs, oftentimes, the doctors just suck. Obstetricians, for example, are experts on delivering babies. But after that, its not their field of expertise. Point being, its stupid of you to assume that doctors know anything about lactation/breastfeeding–and even if they do, they do not have the expertise or resources to show someone how to do it properly.

By the way, many of us have shitty insurance (if any at all) that doesn’t allow us to make use of specialists free of charge. $20 or $100/year is a bargain.

“I just don’t get why something mankind has performed successfully for the last ???? years (hence why you, I and everyone else reading this are here) somehow now requires support groups and certified consultants.”

Are you serious? I don’t want to sound patronizing, but your ignorance runs deep, so I’ll try not to sound like I’m taking to a kindergardener. Breastfeeding is painful and not intuitive. If done PROPERLY, it is excruciatingly painful (for most women) before they, their bodies, and their babies, become accustomed to it. If done IMPROPERLY, it can lead to all kinds of heinous shit, and will damage the mother and the child.

While it may be shocking to you that something so critical to our survival as a species doesn’t just work out of the box, if you used your brain for a minute, you would realize that there’s nothing unusual about this. Yeah, women can give birth on their own by squatting in a field (or the savannah). But a good portion of them will die in the process. It works a lot better when someone with experience (like a doctor, midwife or shaman) helps them.

Traditionally, women in the USA, like in most other cultures, LEARNED how to breastfeed with the help of their mothers/grandmothers/sisters/whatever. But in the mid-twentieth century, the medical establishment decided that formula was as good as breastfeeding, and since its a hell of a lot easier to feed your kid formula, that’s what the vast majority of women did. Fast forward 20-30 years later, and the medical establishment changes its stance. Breastfeeding, they say is the best thing for your child (NO SHIT), and all of a sudden women start breastfeeding again. But this time, their mothers and the generation of women preceding them, didn’t breastfeed, so they can’t teach them how to do it. That is the world we live in. A world were many of us weren’t breastfed. That is why there are lactation consultants.

Like I said, $20 is a bargain. And if I sound pissed, I am. A lactation consultant (not at the Stork Store) saved us. I watched my wife trying to feed our daughter, bleeding from her chewed up, abscessed nipples, while legions of dumbass doctors and nurses and family members just let her suffer because they didn’t know any better.

God bless lactation consultants.

missheather on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 5:39 am


Well, that’s quite something (what was it again?) Queefs of absence.

red hat on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 11:05 am


I agree with the previous writer: This post is ignorant, hostile and insulting.

elmire on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 11:19 am


hey miss heather… I have to say that the idea of a lactation consultant would have seemed downright stupid to me, too, before I had my daughter. now, I know how god-awful and painfully difficult it is to learnto breastfeed a baby — in short, it fucking SUCKS (no pun intened) and no one can prepare you for the hell of it all – emotionally or physically. jesus christ, BIRTH was easier.

so rock on, lactation consulatants. bring forth your boob knowledge and go help some poor new mom through the shittiest times of new-baby-hood.

bestviewinbrooklyn on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 11:22 am


Nothing like lactation to get people going! I’ll try to not emit a queef as I comment. 😉

Most perverts will be disappointed, I’m sure. The idea that boobs will be swinging around at a “breastfeeding circle” is one that will probably lead to a major let-down. (Pun entirely intended.)

I’d say that the meeting charge might reek of gentrification (La Leche League meetings are free, although you can choose to pay a $40 yearly membership fee), and calling it a “circle” makes me think of those “men’s nature circles” from the 80’s. Then again, it’s also kind of like “drum circle” – and that can lead to good times.

Besides the fee, the only other ways it seems like a sign of gentrification is that 1) it’s public (oh my god! public reference to boobs doing what they are meant to!) and 2) that nursing, especially long-term, seems to be something considered a privilege. Formula is covered by WIC, and it’s really pushed on lower-income mothers. It’s pushed on most mothers, but you only have to walk by some of the shops over here to see the cases and cases of formula stacked up to know there’s some business going on. The formula companies (like Nestle!) don’t donate the formula to the WIC program. Whether or not a mom is working, it seems like formula is touted as the more sure, more easy method of feeding. Personally, I’m thankful that I don’t have to sterilize bottles, boil water, or buy the “special baby water.” Formula works great for many people (practically my entire generation grew up on it), but in my opinion, it’s too bad that its use is so lopsided.

I have to agree with LeavesOfAbsence on at least one point: Going to a doctor with nursing problems (I’m old school, I say nursing) is not always the best choice. I have never been asked or offered any advice about nursing by my pediatrician or OB/GYN. I didn’t ask either, but there you go. That said, the LC at the hospital and the LC who happened to run the La Leche meetings I went to were both very helpful. Even so, there are still issues that pop up – especially early on or if someone ended up with a c-section or complications.

Going to a doctor is also quite expensive, even with insurance, it’s an ever-growing co-pay. And many doctors will refer you to a….Lactation Consultant. What?? It’s cheap if the group keeps going…it’s not so cheap when compared to the FREE options that you mentioned or LLLI.org.

leavesofabsence on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 2:17 pm


It certainly is. Your use of italics is tremendous. And juvenile. Piss Heather.

By the way, I love the blog. Loyal reader.

missheather on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 4:15 pm


Right back at yaLeaves! I knew you were busting my chops. 😉

BVIB: I take the new baby has arrived? Congrats!

leavesofabsence on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 5:17 pm


MissH:

The baby (she) is here, and lurking the streets of Greenpoint. I am certainly busting your chops, because I disagree with you on some of the above issues. Doesn’t mean I love the blog (or you) any less.

superclam on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 8:23 pm


Call me immature, but both Queefs of absence and Piss Heather had me giggling like a school girl.

missheather on Wed, 3rd Dec 2008 9:35 pm


We do it for you, Superclam. 😉

By the way, just got back from Long Island City. Even after dark the L Haus is H-I-D-E-O-U-S. Which one of those turds (by the Pulaski) do you think will have a semi drive into someone’s living room first? My money is on the neoclassical piece of crap.

al oof on Thu, 4th Dec 2008 3:03 am


my mom didn’t breastfeed any of us (she had 4), so if i had kids, which i won’t, and if i were to breastfeed them, which i would, except i won’t have any, i wouldn’t have her to get advice from. actually i’m pretty sure she’d give me shit for it and advise me to just not do it. my 2 sisters in law, who have both had kids, are also super anti-breastfeeding (‘it’s like giving all the poisons you’ve ever been exposed to to the kids!).

i’ve also heard stories of babies dying when their mom’s didn’t realize they weren’t getting enough milk. a woman in the bronx went to prison for it a few years ago and it was pretty sad, at least according to what i saw, because there was really no reason she would have known anything was wrong. the doctor didn’t even tell her that there were risks to breastfeeding because she’d had a breast reduction surgery. i’m not sure how this service would help, since the women on the show i saw hadn’t realized anything was wrong, but certainly it’s not just something that comes naturally and it is something that needs to be talked about and taught.

and i have to pay a $35 dollar copay every time i see the doctor.

bestviewinbrooklyn on Thu, 4th Dec 2008 9:49 am


This baby is also here (and a girl this time), but she’s hanging around Sunset for now. I’m introducing her to the exquisite new architecture going up all over the neighborhood.

missheather on Thu, 4th Dec 2008 10:38 am


Be careful BVIB, I don’t think you want your little girl’s first word to be “Fedders”! 😉

leavesofabsence on Thu, 4th Dec 2008 1:44 pm


al oof:

You can do and think what you like, in terms of feeding your kids if you ever have them. You should know, however, that, anecdotal evidence aside, nursing is superior to giving babies formula.

Its not even debatable at this point. Case closed.

missheather on Thu, 4th Dec 2008 4:25 pm


In my humble the opinion the only argument that has been successfully debated in this forum (and even then, unintentionally) is one for socialized medicine.

That way EVERYONE can have a lactation consultant. Free, no less! 🙂

al oof on Sun, 7th Dec 2008 7:39 pm


definitely socialized healthcare!

leavesofabsence: you don’t have to convince me. i know that breastfeeding is better than not. i was just making the argument that if someone chooses to breastfeed, neither doctors nor family are necessarily a support system for it.

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